Royal Charters

In this episode, our hosts are joined by Director of Archives and Collections, Linda Romeril, who talks to us about Jersey's Royal Charters.

Taking us back to 1341 and and the first Charter issued to the people of Jersey by Edward II.  Linda will explain what a Charter represents, and how they were used by the monarchy with the people of Jersey throughout our Island's history.

Further Charters from Richard II and Charles II are explored along with the story around them, what was happening at the time and why the Island's people were issued the various Charters.

You can visit an exhibition about the Royal Charters at Mont Orgueil Castle | Jersey Heritage.  Or support Jersey Archive to conserve important documents my making a donation Fundraising | Jersey Heritage.

Transcript

The Jersey Heritage Podcast: The Small Island, Big Story Sessions

The Royal Charters with Linda Romeril 

Perry (00:02):

Welcome to the Jersey Heritage Podcast,

Mel (00:05):

The Small Island Big Story Sessions.

Perry (00:08):

You are listening to Mel and Perry.

Mel (00:12):

In today's episode, we dip back into the Jersey Archive Collection to explore the royal charters.

Perry (00:18):

Joined by Linda, our archives and collections director, we discussed the charters of monarchs such as Edward ii, Richard II and Charles ii.

Mel (00:29):

Welcome Linda, to your third episode for the Small Island Big Story Sessions. We really love having you in the studio to talk all things archival collection. So, so to get us started, and for those who might not know, what are the royal charters?

Linda (00:45):

So, a charter is a word that's widely used in particularly the medieval period, but you know, we, we still use it today. It's a document. The Royal Charters are a document from the Monarch to either a an individual, it could be to a group of people, it could be to a community. In the case of the Royal Charters to Jersey, obviously it's to the whole island. So they're used for lots of different things. They can be used to convey land. So if, if the Monarch wanted to reward one of his loyal followers, maybe somebody who'd supported him in a battle, he would then issue a charter, giving them a particular piece of land. A lot of the abbeys. So this is a period, obviously, where the abbeys are very powerful. So the abbeys, again, would have charters issued by the Monarch, giving, giving them certain rights maybe to different fields, lands. Also trading rights we can see through charters. So they're quite multipurpose. Right. But in the case of the Royal Charters, it's very much about the position of Jersey in relation to the English crown.

Perry (01:51):

So where, where is our first charter that, that came to Jersey then? And when is that from?

Linda (01:57):

So the first one that was issued to the people of Jersey was actually issued by Edward ii, and this was in 1341. Oh, wow. So we're in the middle of the hundred Years War. So we're in a position where as, as we are for quite a lot of the medieval period England is at war with France. Edward III is going over to France. He wants to get some of the possessions back that were lost when King John won Normandy. So he's off, he's a very I suppose he's a bit of a warrior King Edward ii, he's going over with his, his group of buddies, and he's trying to take back some of the possessions in France. And Jersey becomes very important at this point because obviously Jersey is between England and France. So Edward wants the people of Jersey to remain loyal to him.

Linda (02:49):

So prior to this, people in Jersey had asked for their rights to be written down, but it hadn't happened because it wasn't something that the Monarch felt they needed to do. But in this case, because England and France were at war Edward Codifies writes down the relationship between the island and the Crown, and it's basically based on Norman customary law. So this is this not a law that would've been in place in England. It's part of Jersey being part of Normandy before 1204. So I'm gonna just read out Edwards charter, unfortunately we don't have a copy of Edwards Charter in Jersey. But all the, all the royal charters, you would basically get a copy that would've been sent out to the people who were receiving the grant, and then a copy would be enrolled. So for all the charters we're gonna talk about, there's an enrolled copy in the national archive, and then for some of them we have the copy that would've been sent out at the time.

Perry (03:54):

What happened to this one, then the, the one that was sent to Jersey

Linda (03:57):

We dunno, a lot of our medieval charters are missing, which is a real, real shame. We do know in the early 15 hundreds there was a fire in the bailiff's house, and this was where all the documents were kept. And we have a record that a loss of medieval documents were burnt in the fire. Oh, shame. So our assumption is this is probably such shame. I know, it's such shame. When was that fire? It was early for 1502, I think. Right, okay. So early 15 hundreds. But yeah, incredible shame. I mean, thankfully because they were enrolled, we've still got the text, so we know what it says. Yeah. But we haven't got actual Yeah, the actual document. Actual document, yeah. Which is a real shame. So basically what the 1341 charters, this is Edwards Charter. He basically says, we concede for ourselves and our heirs that the people of Jersey hold and retain all privileges, liberties, immunities, and customs granted by our forebearers or of other legal competencies. He's basically saying Norman customary law is the law in the islands, and that's quite different to what was happening in England at the time. Yeah.

Perry (05:10):

And what were these chart, what language were these charters written in them? Were they all in Latin?

Linda (05:14):

They were all in Latin, yeah. Yeah, because that was the language of the English chancery at the time. So all in Latin, and they would've been sealed. So with Royal documents, and I believe it's still the same today the Monarch wouldn't sign like we would sign the seal is the signature. Right. So they must be really beautiful to look at. Yeah. The seals are amazing, particularly as we get into the the charters from, I suppose Elizabeth, the first onwards, there's some really lovely seals. Mm. And the nicest thing about the seals is, well, I think <laugh>, they're, so, they're always the same. So on one side of the seal you have the king or the queen sitting on their throne as the ruler, and then on the back of the seal, you always have the king or the queen on horseback as the leader of the army.

Linda (06:05):

Oh, wow. And that's consistent up until, actually, up until Elizabeth, I second her seal is the same. So we've got copies of seal. Wow. So yeah. Doesn't, so the same thing. But she, because she rained obviously for a long, long time her seal matrix. So that's basically what, what makes the seal actually needed to be replaced much, much later in her reign. And they decided, because at the time she would've been, I think potentially in her eighties or nineties, that having her on horseback wasn't appropriate. Yeah, yeah. So they changed the back of the seal, and I think it's now the coat of arms. And Charles III has kept that right coat of arms rather than as the rulers of the armies. And

Perry (06:51):

Do we still have the wax with the, the, like the imprint of the seal matrix?

Linda (06:56):

So we've got for, what's the earliest one? We've got the seal for probably not till Elizabeth the first. So a lot of the early seals have gone because yeah, they're really vulnerable. They hang off the bottom of the documents. So over time they've just either been broken or, or just removed from the document completely. Yeah. But we do have some, we have a lovely Elizabeth first one where you can actually see, like she's sitting there with her rough and a great big dress on, and so, so you can tell it's her. Yeah. and then there's some really nice Charles, the second ones. So later periods we do have the seals for,

Perry (07:37):

Funny enough, you've got those big kind of royal seals, but we also get in jersey and also all over France and Britain as well, smaller personal seals from around that period as well, where it'll just have like, you know, a picture of a boat or the, the coat of arms and it'll just say Seal of Richard something. It's quite nice to kind of compare how crazy these these royal Seals are compared to just, you know, the local trader guy, you know.

Linda (08:03):

Yeah. Just the little sort of, and I think the I think the ecclesiastical ones are always oval. Yes. So like if you ever get an ecclesiastical one, a bishop or

Perry (08:13):

I've recorded one of those. Yeah, yeah. We've got a, a 14th century one, so around this period and it's it has like a picture of Mary and Jesus on it, and it says like the Lord's prayer in like, short around the sides. So yeah, it's interesting comparing the different types.

Linda (08:29):

So what's the second one that we have? So the second one we have, so we're only on the first one. Yeah. <Laugh>. So end the third. So he gives the charter and that's, that sort of starts a whole series of charters. And what they're really called after that is confirmatory charters. So it's basically subsequent monarchs confirming that they're happy to abide with the original ed with the third charter. So the first one that we have after that is 1378. And this one we do have the original at the archive, which is really lovely. It's our oldest document. It's it's on parchment or, or vellum. It's in Latin. It is quite fragile. It's in quite poor condition. But it's great that we still it, but we still have it. Yeah.

Perry (09:18):

Which is the main thing, right?

Linda (09:19):

Yeah. So, so that was 1378. So this is Richard ii and he's actually Edward's grandson. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. So he came to the throne when he was quite young. I think he was only 10 years old succeeding his grandfather, his father had died, his father was the black prince. If people know about medieval history, the Black Prince, again, very, very famous. He fought in wars in France when he was in his late teens. But unfortunately he died before Edward iii. So his son succeeded when he was quite young which II's quite well known for the peasants revolt if people have heard of that. So he was not the most stable of kings on his throne. He had a lot of problems to deal with. And again, I think he wanted to make sure that the people of Jersey were there as a bit of a buffer between England and France. So again, important that he confirmed that earlier charter, especially as this was the first time it was confirmed. He could have just said, no, I'm not, I'm not giving those rights away. But he actually confirmed the previous one.

Perry (10:24):

Yeah. We were talking about this in the last podcast actually, about the Battle of Jersey in that jersey's basically been the frontline <laugh> of the war for, you know, the best part of a thousand years. Really. Yeah. We're just like the stepping stone, aren't we? To the big Yeah. Until pretty recently <laugh>. Yeah. Yeah. It was kind of

Linda (10:41):

A Yeah, absolutely. I mean, even in the German occupation, it was a sort of, yeah, yeah. You know, an important stepping stone may, may be more important propaganda wise than actually militarily. Yeah. But yeah, it's, it's really interesting how suddenly once France has, once Normandy Hass lost jersey's sort of on the front line really, as you say, for a thousand years. So yeah,

Linda (11:04):

So Richard II issued the charter he did issue a subsequent charter to the people of Jersey, which basically gave them additional trading rights. So basically gave them exemptions from things like custom duties. Right. so obviously that's actually quite important. It's quite lucrative if you don't have to pay customs on your goods that are going in and out. So he really wanted to carry favor, I suppose, with the Islanders by giving in these extra privileges. That was in the 1390s. But then we reached a point where his cousin Henry iv seized the throne. Richard was sent into exile. Henry confirmed the original charter the 1341, but not the subsequent trading rights. Right. probably because

Perry (12:00):

Yeah, legitimizing

Linda (12:02):

Fraction. It's almost like that legitimizing, it's fine to go back to the 1341 because that was a different monarch, but he doesn't want to legitimize Richard the second. Yeah. So lots going on at the time, <laugh>, and of course the Jersey people are kind of stuck within that. Again, the war with France are still going on at the time. So Henry IV, I suppose, recognized it was important to keep the Islanders on side, but he wasn't gonna legitimize the, the later charter.

Mel (12:29):

It's so interesting when you think about how like, like how we just mentioned, Jersey's kind of always like on that parapet of being involved, but not quite. But it would've been interesting to know what people would've thought at the time where their loyalties lied in terms of their, their French kind of English roots. Or it would've just been interesting to know where people kind of fav what, what side they favored.

Linda (12:51):

Yeah. And you've got lots of families, haven't you, where you've got Norman roots, French roots but also English as well. I mean, you've gotta think at the time a lot of the English Aris were descended from the Norman Barron mm-hmm <affirmative>. So it's a real Yeah. It's a real mix between,

Mel (13:07):

Between. Yeah. It's like a proper melting,

Linda (13:08):

Isn't

Perry (13:09):

It? Yeah. And even at the time when you just think about how close France is and you know, the fishermen are always probably running into each other and you're probably trading because they're your closest neighbors. Yeah. And you know, during these times of war, like how, how was that kind of navigated? You know, did everyone go actually gonna just avoid going to Normandy or Brittany at the moment? Or were they just like, well, we'll just kind of not be hostile to each other just for everybody's sake, you know? It'd be interesting to have more accounts of normal people back then.

Mel (13:41):

Yeah. And I would've society that's

Perry (13:42):

Always the problem, isn't it, with the, yeah.

Mel (13:44):

Because you'd imagine the England would've just felt really far away. Like, not, not just geographically, but like socially as well. 'cause Like we would've had more kind of French customs at the time. Right. Yeah.

Perry (13:54):

But it's, it is amazing how these political things can, can shape. I mean we all they do. Yeah. You know, you'd think we'd speak French now almost, wouldn't you? But

Linda (14:03):

Yeah, so no, I mean it is, is interesting. And I suppose you've got those two sections of society, haven't you? You've got those who were the higher sections of society who quite possibly had land interests off island. Mm-Hmm. And then you, yeah. You've just got the people going about their normal everyday business speaking French, trading with the French but at the same time in theory being at war Yeah. With them. Yeah.

Perry (14:27):

It's, it I guess everybody's kind of just, it's all up to what the, the seniors and, and the higher ups want to do. As a kind of common person, you probably didn't even expect to have much effect or rights on any of that. And maybe you just didn't really care. You know, it depends how it affects the individual, I guess.

Mel (14:49):

So what's the deal with these charters in terms of like, they is is a monarch releasing them quite steadily within their Reign u

Linda (14:56):

Usually when they come to the throne, usually within a couple of years they will release a confirmation charter. So basically saying yes, we agree with everything that was in the 1341. Then occasionally you get these additional charters depending on the situation at the time. So I think one of the really interesting ones that we do have a copy of is a charter from Edward iv. And it's actually one interestingly probably about 15 years ago she came up for auction in the uk. So kind of interesting that this document that was given to the people of Jersey somehow ended up being in somebody's private collection. Yeah.

Mel (15:38):

That's really bizarre. Right.

Linda (15:39):

Wow. So we're not quite sure how that happened. I mean, we were really lucky that the the receiver general, the Crown bought the document back for the island right at the time, which was great 'cause it was really important that it came back to us. But it's quite interesting. So this one is from the period of the wars of the Roses. So we've got the Yorkers, we've got the Lancastrians Edward IV becomes king in 14 60, 61. And then he's monarch for about 10 years until he gets overthrown by the Lancastrians. He then comes back and retakes the throne. So it's really all over the place. Piece of history. Yeah. Of drama. Yeah. Lots of battles, lots of drama, <laugh> you know, amazing stories. But what's interesting is Edward is in England. He's taken over from the Lancastrians, from Henry the vi.

Linda (16:42):

But Jersey at the time was then occupied by the French. So this is probably the occupation that people know less about. Obviously we know lots about the German occupation, but Jersey was also occupied in the 1460s for about eight years by the French. And the document that we have from Edward dates from just after the occupation. And he's basically saying to the people of Jersey, you know, it's, it's great that my army and your loyal people have liberated the island. You're now back as part of the English throne. But then he says, but actually it was actually quite expensive retaking the islands. Oh my God. Yeah. So as a result, you owe me, let me find the sum.

Mel (17:31):

No

Linda (17:32):

Right <laugh>, no. So it's 2,833 pounds, six shillings and eight pence.

Mel (17:40):

That would've been a lot of money, which

Linda (17:42):

Is a lot of money. So what he's saying is, it's wonderful. Everyone's come back to me. Everyone's loyal to the English crown of it's fantastic. But at the same time, actually it was really expensive. And to be fair to him, he's at a point where, you know, the chancery in England is pretty much run dry. There've been wars in England for civil war for the last 10, 20 years. So what he's saying to the people of Jersey is, you owe me this quite large sum of money. What he does do is he gives them a mechanism to pay it back. Yeah. So he says, I recognize that this is a lot of money, but what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna give you rights to cha trade through, call a Right.

Mel (18:21):

Right.

Linda (18:22):

So at this point, call a would be would've been English. And you only certain people had the right to trade through Cali to France. It was very lucrative. So he gave specific people. And it's really nice in the document, 'cause we actually do have the names of the people who got the rights to trade. And some of them we do know Lamonia is still a surname that people would have today in the islands. William Moji or Mosier. Yeah. So again, that's the name that we'd still know today. So we've got this list of people and they're given this right to trade through Callay. And the idea is that they trade through Callay makes the island more lucrative, and then they pay off the debt a little bit at a time. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. So he's not setting them up to fail. He's saying, okay, there's a way we can both make some money outta this.

Mel (19:16):

Did they have like a deadline as to when they had to pay it back?

Linda (19:18):

Nothing in the document seems to say that. Right. So I know whether they did or not. We don't know.

Mel (19:25):

That's crazy, isn't it?

Perry (19:27):

Recouping some of that tax. He hasn't had <laugh>,

Linda (19:29):

<Laugh>, you don't have to pay customs. So <laugh>. Yeah.

Mel (19:33):

Yeah. Wow. But amazing that we still have all those names that we can then compare.

Linda (19:39):

Yeah. Really interesting. So we consider see some of the, it's it's Jersey and Guernsey. So the document covers both actually. So some of these will be Sey names and then some of them, I mean Car Raiser definitely a Guernsey name. But then we've got Jersey <inaudible>, that's the name that probably still I think exists today. But yeah, great to have the names from that early. So this is the 1460s. Wow.

Perry (20:02):

And with those names, do we have any other like documents that we can like cross reference them with or? 

Linda (20:07):

We have a little bit. So we've got a Anant from it's about, yeah, 60 years later. So it is a little bit later. So we're probably talking descendants rather than the same individuals. But we do have a lot of the names listed in the extant, which is basically list of people paying dues to the king or the crown. So we do see some of the same names listed.

Mel (20:34):

So from all the charters that we have which Monarch released the most,

Linda (20:40):

The most we have are Charles II ones. 

Mel (20:43):

And what year around, what was, when was he around? So

Linda (20:45):

Charles, I second is English civil War. So this is actually the one that's on display in the museum at the moment. So the one on display is from 1662, which is just after Charles was restored to the English throne. And this is the very famous, this is probably the most famous charter locally because it's the one that acknowledges the assistance that Jersey gave Charles when he was in exile. It grants the island extra privileges, it confirms the original privileges and it grants the mace, which is still carried in the royal court. In the royal court today. Yeah. So it's probably the most famous one, I would say. And yeah, it, it's, it's important. It's part of him being restored to the monarchy. I think one of the interesting things is it's, we said, talked about the medieval charters being in Latin. They actually start moving into English in the 16 hundreds. Oh, interesting. But then they move back again.

Mel (21:43):

Oh.

Linda (21:44):

So, because Charles obviously he'd been restored to the throne, he kind of wanted to restore the majesty, the mystique of the monarchy. So he went back to Latin. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. Not for very long. They go into English after that, but it's almost a kind of repossession of that kind of very formal language. So his is in Latin, whereas we have earlier ones that are actually in English.

Mel (22:12):

Yeah. And I guess Latin was like the, the language of the church, wasn't it? It's like the Catholic church. So

Perry (22:17):

Yeah. So when they went Protestant they were like, right. Yeah. Scrub that. Exactly. When you're speaking there's like the Bible and everything back then as well.

Linda (22:24):

Yeah. Yeah. James at first would've been in English, so that's early 16 hundreds. So yeah.

Perry (22:30):

And so what other signs were, so obviously he came to Jersey, he was exiled here. Is there any other documents from his time here that maybe aren't as, you know major as a charter?

Linda (22:43):

Yeah, so I think he's a good example. So we've got our very, the big, the, the royal charters to the whole island confirming all these privileges, giving additional privileges. I mean, but then we've got lots of charters from the Monarch to individuals for different reasons. So sometimes it's appointing people. So when Walter Riley was appointed by Elizabeth first as governor of Jersey, there was a charter issued appointing him as governor. And we have a copy of that at the archive. So yeah, it could be land rights particularly. So Charles basically the people that he, that helped him when he was here in the island, he did reward them by granting various different land rights. One of the things he did do is Grant Laurel Hampton a charter. So Hampton, obviously Hampton Farm. Hampton Farm <laugh>. Yeah. So Laurel Hampton lived at what is now Hampton Country Life Museum.

Linda (23:42):

And as I think people may know after the execution of Charles, i Jersey was one of the first places to proclaim Charles I second as king. He wasn't proclaimed king in England until over 10 years later when the monarchy was restored. So when Charles was obviously visited Jersey and then the people had proclaimed him king in the marketplace. And Laura Hampton was one of the people who was instrumental in, in that. So Charles basically granted Laurel the right to remove the end tail on his property. And that's all about how you inherit property in the island. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. So what Lauren was then allowed to do was to pass Hampton from air to air, whether male or female direct or maternal. So it just gave him the right to maybe sit outside the customary laws of inheritance and it meant that the property could be kept together. 'cause That was always the worry in Jersey, that if you had lots of children, things got divided into smaller and smaller holdings. So actually by removing that end tail, it gave the family the freedom to keep the property together. One of the interesting things about that document, it's I believe from 1649, and it's one of the only documents in the world that has Charles II's original seal. Right.

Mel (25:11):

Wow.

Linda (25:12):

So when he, when Charles first died in 1649, Charles II obviously proclaimed king in Jersey, proclaimed king in Scotland. And he had a great seal made up that was replaced in 1660 when he was restored to the monarchy in England. So most of the documents have got the, the 1660 seal. There are a handful, three or four locally and I think maybe one off island that have the earlier seal. So it's nice that we've got that as part of our

Mel (25:44):

History. Yeah, that's incredible that we have that. I think what fascinates me about these documents is the size of them. 'cause They're, they're quite large. They're about an a two size sheet, would you say Linda?

Linda (25:56):

Between, yes. I would say a

Mel (25:58):

Eight. Yeah. About an a two size. So they maybe, yeah, they're quite, yeah, actually yeah, maybe even a one. They're really, really quite large and they're really beautiful to look at in terms of like the script on the writing is beautiful. I'd be really interested in actually seeing Queen Elizabeth the firsts chart, because I could imagine that would look amazing.

Linda (26:17):

So it's quite interesting because I'm gonna disappoint you now, <laugh>. Oh

Mel (26:21):

No, <laugh>.

Linda (26:23):

So basically the documents get more and more elaborate over time. Mm. So the early ones, I should have bought a picture, but the early ones are very simple. There's no illustrations. They're quite small quite brief. And then as we move forward, they get more and more elaborate. So once we get into the 17th century, so the Charles, the second ones, the James, the first ones, they've got a very elaborate border which has a picture of the monarch lots of heraldry. So you see lots of symbols for the different countries. So you'll see thistles because they're claiming to be Scotland, Kings of Scotland. Lovely. So there's all that kind of really artistic very beautiful. They've even got, I think, ese on some of them. 'cause They're still claiming the French throne at this time. Oh, right, right, right. So just really interesting. The James, the first is the only one we've got that's in color and that that's really beautiful. So all of the border is colored with sort of gold leaf and beautiful blues and reds. It's, it's really, really lovely. And then the Charles ones aren't covered, but they have the same kind of very elaborate illustrations.

Perry (27:41):

So it must have been a, a real artist scribe professional who, who made these charters down.

Linda (27:47):

Yeah. I mean, I do wonder with the later ones whether it's almost like a bit of a proforma. Yeah. I think as we go forward, 'cause we've got from Victoria and right through to Elizabeth ii. So I think it becomes that. But they are beautiful. I mean, I always think, 'cause I mean they're writing these pages and pages of Latin. I mean, if they made a mistake, I don't quite know.

Perry (28:07):

Oh God, yeah. Start

Linda (28:09):

The whole thing again. What they, to start the whole thing again or scrape it out. But you, you can't really see any evidence of that. So yeah, either there's some little mistakes in there or somebody was very accurate.

Mel (28:21):

Come and visit the Jersey Museum for free. We've got so much to explore. Our new exhibition, LA Terry Jeri on the first floor, the Victorian House, and our Geo Park visitor center. We look forward to welcoming you to our free museum.

Perry (28:40):

So does, so we still get the charters in today,

Linda (28:43):

Then we don't get the confirmation ones. Unfortunately, that's stopped in the 17th century, which is a bit of a shame. But we do sometimes still get, so we've got some royal charters from Elizabeth ii. Okay. Which are all about education in the island. So it's all to do with the Howard Davis scholarship which was set up. And then the Elizabeth II charter extends that to girls as well as boys, which is quite nice. Oh. So originally it was a scholarship just for boys for, for education. But then they extended it to girls as well. And again, we've got not, not quite so fancy or big, but really beautiful red wax seal of Elizabeth ii. So we still get them in 19th and 20th century, but not quite the same sort of confirmation of the island status, but for different sorts of reasons.

Perry (29:41):

But none of the current king?

Linda (29:44):

No, not yet, yet.

Mel (29:46):

It's incredible how much information they, they give us about what was going on at the time and, and like kind of information about local people as well. Are there any other really interesting stories that you've come across with the charters that you think would be good to share?

Linda (30:01):

So there's some quite nice ones. Again, Charles ii so he granted various pardons to people living in the island who supported the Commonwealth cause. And we've got one of his charters granting a pardon to Richard Hamill. And it basically just says he's pardoning him for offenses committed during the time of the Civil War and the Commonwealth. So Charles was quite pragmatic when he came back to the throne in that he didn't immediately go and punish anyone who had been involved in the Commonwealth period. He, he did punish the ides, the people who effectively committed his father to be executed. But everyone else he was pretty pragmatic with. Yeah. And we can see that in Jersey. He's basically saying he, he pledges when he's restored to the monarchy that no crime committed against us or our royal father shall rise in judgment against any man. So he's saying, you know, I understand that this has happened, but going forward, obviously we need to come together, as I say, accept the, the s the people who were responsible for executing his father. So very pragmatic pardons granted to people who supported the Commonwealth. And including this Richard de Hael,

Perry (31:20):

I guess you don't want to start, you know, punishing people. Then you start another civil war basically. In fact, a square one again.

Linda (31:28):

Yeah. I think it's, if you're too harsh to people who've fought against you, then they'll rise up. Whereas if you're a bit more sensible to give them, they're more likely to be on your side going forward. Which seems to have been what, what happened.

Mel (31:43):

How big are, how big are Elizabeth II's charters? Do they, do they follow the same format?

Linda (31:50):

No, they're not as big as the older ones, ironically. They are more, I would say I should, to be honest with you, not much bigger than an A

Mel (32:01):

Four. Are they handwritten

Linda (32:03):

Still? No, they're printed.

Mel (32:04):

They're printed, they're printed.

Linda (32:06):

But then they've still got the seal on the bottom. But again, it all depend on the formality as well because those ones are obviously around education and scholarships. So not as formal as a charter, which is talking about privileges for the whole island. So it does depend on how formal the document is, the scope and the reach of the document. So those are relatively small ones. Yeah,

Mel (32:33):

I'd be interested in seeing those. Well, yeah, more the more modern ones to see how they compare.

Perry (32:38):

So obviously we've got these big seals that the, all these charters are sealed with. Do we have any, like, anything signed just with his hand or any of the monarch's hands?

Linda (32:48):

So for Charles second we do, because obviously he came to the island. So as you know, Charles came to Jersey before he, when he was a prince. So whilst his father was still alive and he stayed at Elizabeth Castle. And amazingly, I'm not sure how it survived 'cause it's quite a small, maybe a five scrap of paper. Really? Yeah. And it's the bill from his cleaning lady, so it's in English. And she basically says this is my bill for cleaning his majesty's chambers for two weeks. She signed it, her name's Mary Grimshaw. So we think that she came over possibly with Charles and his entourage because it's not a Jersey name. It's not Jersey name. Right. It's not a name that comes up in anything else. So we think potentially she, she was part of the group of people who came to the island, but at the bottom of the bill, he's just put, he's written, pay this cr and then underneath we've got his his finance minister finance person basically saying, this is his majesty's own hand. You know, it is fine, you can go, go ahead and pay this lady for her, for her cleaning.

Perry (33:59):

Says pay this cr who's R

Linda (34:01):

So Charles.

Perry (34:02):

Oh right. That's just, yeah, what he went by.

Linda (34:04):

So Charles it would be Rex.

Perry (34:07):

Oh of course. Charles

Linda (34:08):

Rex. So King Charles. Effectively,

Mel (34:10):

That's amazing that we still have that now. It's, it's how has that lasted? I guess it would've been a like really be like a really special document for that person to keep.

Linda (34:19):

Yes. I mean it's, it is amazing. I mean we've got other letters from Charles as well, so we've got that one. But we do have letters sent was, he was in Jersey to various individuals. Some of them are in code. Oh, oh. Which is really interesting. That's really cool. Because obviously again, he was at, at war at the time, so he's sending letters to his allies on the continent people in Scotland. And he's got like a numeric code. So he'll write some of the letter in English and then obviously the important bit. So maybe who or where or when or what was happening that will all be coded in numbers. I dunno if anyone's ever actually Oh, cracked it. Decoded it.

Perry (34:58):

There'll be someone out there who can,

Linda (34:59):

I'm sure somebody who Yeah, if, if that, if nobody has, I'm sure somebody can wonder what it is. 

Perry (35:05):

That'd be a good job. That'd be a good project for like a, a student or a, or someone who's doing, I dunno what you do it, you need to do decoding, but there's gotta be some <laugh>, there's gotta be somewhere they do it, you know?

Linda (35:17):

Yeah, no, it'd be fascinating. I say you can, I'm sure it must be the names of people or places. 'cause They're sort of saying, we'll meet you here and then it's wherever it is, is, is coded. But some of those are signed by Charles as well. So we do have quite a lot for Charles. Yeah. Which is great because of his connections with the island. But I think the cleaning ladies Bill is one of our favorites. It's quite expensive as well. Yeah. I think it's something like 70 leave for two weeks,

Perry (35:44):

Which seems, and what would that be in, in our, it seems

Linda (35:46):

Quite a lot. I'm not sure, but yeah,

Perry (35:48):

I guess, I guess she's got a lot money. Anything double

Mel (35:50):

Figures back then sounds like a lot. Right? Guess

Perry (35:52):

If you want a job doing well, <laugh> pay a lot of money for

Mel (35:55):

It. Get paid by the king himself. Yeah.

Perry (35:57):

<Laugh>, he probably, probably didn't even, probably didn't even think about it. He was like, just whatever she asked for, just just give it.

Mel (36:04):

So for anyone out there that has like a favorite monarch, can we just go through like all the, all the different charters that we have? So from the beginning, the, like all the different kings and queens that we have at the archive

Linda (36:16):

In Okay. The original ones, the OTs. So we have Richard II is our first charter, so that's 1378. The next one we have will be the Edward iv. So this is the one about retaking the island and asking the people to contribute to that. So the Edward, the fourth one, I think we probably then skip forward Henry seventh. We've got copies of his documents, but nothing original. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. And I think the same with Henry viii. We do have Elizabeth the first with the lovely beautiful seal. I love hair in the rough the first. So that's great. And then as we get into the 17th century, then we start getting quite a lot more documents. So we'll have James the first lots of Charles the second, as we said, lots of documents about Charles the second including charters and letters and all sorts of things. We've definitely got some from Victoria. Do we we do. So some charters from Victoria. Pretty sure we've got a George the third one as well. Oh wow. And then definitely Elizabeth ii.

Mel (37:31):

How did the, how do Queen Victorias differ then? Because Victorians were quite, they're quite flamboyant. They,

Linda (37:37):

Yeah. The Queen Victoria ones are lovely. So again, you've got that big illuminated, lovely they're often around things like trade and patents. So patents become a big thing. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>. Yeah. In sort of 19th, 20th century. So a lot of those are around patents. So basically making sure that other people don't take your inventive ideas. Very Victorian inventive age. So that tends to be the Victoria ones around that. And then as we said with Elizabeth second, the ones we have are all around education.

Perry (38:09):

And is that, is it kind of Elizabeth ii when they sort of stopped being these really crazy art pieces basically?

Linda (38:15):

Yes. I think Victoria's the last we've got where you have got Yeah. The picture and all the illuminations. Certainly from what we've got. Hmm.

Mel (38:23):

I'd love to see, I'd love to see Victoria's as well. They must be beautiful. Well, thank you very much. That's really, that's really nice to have that timeline so that people can know what, you know, if they have like a favorite Monarch who they can come and see if they don't just wanna come and see all of them. Come and see all of

Perry (38:37):

Them <laugh>. Just need to wait and see what Charles I thirds look like. Now I know. Is he gonna go crazy with them again or Probably not. He doesn't strike me as the calm think,

Mel (38:45):

I feel like he's gonna be, he's quite strained. That'll be quite, yeah. Yeah.

Perry (38:49):

Yeah.

Mel (38:49):

Who knows. Wait, we'll wait and see if we get any,

Perry (38:53):

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well,

Mel (38:54):

Well thank you very much. That's for joining us again, Linda. It's always such a pleasure to have you. If you enjoy today's episode, don't forget to click on the subscribe button for more.